Do the Guardians have too many center fielders, or not enough? (Podcast) (2024)

CLEVELAND, Ohio — Angel Martinez had a rough night in center field for the Guardians on Monday. Tyler Freeman collected three hits in the game, but played second base with a lefty on the mound. Has Cleveland settled on a rotation of former infielders by trade playing center the rest of the season, and can manager Stephen Vogt live with the results defensively if that’s the case?

On Tuesday’s podcast, Paul Hoynes and Joe Noga look at what’s going on in center field for the Guards and what changes they could make if they have to.

Listen and read along with an AI-generated transcript of the podcast below.

Read the automated transcript of today’s podcast below. Because it’s a computer-generated transcript, it may contain errors and misspellings.

Joe Noga (00:15):

Welcome back to the Cleveland Baseball Talk podcast. I’m Joe Noga, joined by Paul Hoynes, the Guardian’s fall once again to the Detroit Tigers in the opener of a four game series. Monday night, eight to two was the score. Tarek Skubal was the story of the game. The Cy Young contender for Detroit gave up a lot of hits, gave up, I believe 10 hits a season high for him, but managed to keep the guardians to one run in the game. The guardians have run up against some pretty tough pitching, starting pitching over the last stretch of games here, and Stephen V says they’ve got to figure out a way to push some runs across the plate against these top line starters.

Paul Hoynes (01:00):

Yeah, Joe, and I don’t know if they’re all top line starters, but they certainly have pitched well against Cleveland. Just listen to this list. Er Montero, Reese Olson, Jack Flaherty, Ty Bradley, Zach Little Ryan Otte from Tampa Bay, Matt Waldron, Dylan C. Michael King, and Terrick Kubel. There’s a couple Cy Young contenders in there, but it’s not like you’re facing fell feller and in his heyday here. So I think it’s a fact that yes, these guys have pitched very, very well. In 10 of the last 11 games, the opposing starters have gone seven and one with an ERA under one under two against Cleveland, but Cleveland’s hitters have not shown up either.

Joe Noga (01:56):

Yeah, the top of the lineup especially has not necessarily hit. They’ve scratched out base hits here and there, but with runners in scoring position with men on base with opportunities to have big innings, these guys are not producing at the plate. We saw Steven Kwan before a ninth inning base hit yesterday, continue to just roll over several times to the second baseman. He’s in a bit of a slump. Jose Ramirez has not Homer in 76 straight plate appearances. His last home run came at the end of June, and Josh Naer looks like he’s really searching out there every time he steps up to the plate. Those three are the guys that sort of drive everything for Cleveland for the top of that lineup, and when they’re not able to produce runs, the team doesn’t look very good.

Paul Hoynes (02:55):

For sure. And what made this team get off to such a great start, Joe was the ability for them to hit in the clutch to hit with runners in scoring position, and they still have a decent batting average with the runners in scoring position, but over these last 11 games, they’re 13 for 69, they’re hitting 180 8 with runners in scoring position. They’re just not getting it done and runners in scoring position. It’s a fickle stat. It goes up and down, but the guardians rode that way for over three months and now I don’t know if just the odds have shifted against them, but some way somehow they’ve got to score some runs.

Joe Noga (03:43):

Yeah, you use some good statistics there. To back up your point, I went diving on FanGraphs and I looked, FanGraphs has a team hitting statistic. It’s a clutch metric that they use. It encompasses runners in scoring position, runners on base, all the situations that you can step up to the plate and through the first two and a half to three months of the season, the guardians were the best in baseball with that particular stat. I think through June 15th, they were 3.95 on that clutch scale, and that was 60 points better than the next closest team they were hitting so well in the clutch that that’s what sort of carried them to the lead that they have in the Al Central since June 15th. So it’s not a huge sample size, a little over a month really. They’re down to 24th in that category. So just that whatever it is that encompasses that ability to hit in the clutch, they’ve sort of lost their way.

(04:57):

They’ve lost their approach a little bit. And that’s something that Austin Hedges talked about after the game was that so many of the guys in the clubhouse are trying to be the guy to come up with the big hit to spark some sort of comeback, to spark some sort of offensive role that everybody’s sort of coming up short at once instead of just doing your part and handing it off to the next guy in the lineup. And that had been their approach the whole time. They’ve gotten away from their approach according to hedges, and they need to get back to that in order to continue to score runs.

Paul Hoynes (05:37):

Yeah, it’s the classic reason for that. Teams go into slumps when they get into the slump. Everybody wants to be the hero instead of doing what they’ve done previously to have that great start, like you were saying, Joe, pass the baton, keep the line moving, keep chain moving. If you can’t get it, draw a walk and let the guy behind you drive you in and you can’t have nine heroes swinging for the fences out there. And I’m not saying that’s what they’re doing, but the approach, the team approach to hitting has become a little disjointed with the guardians right now.

Joe Noga (06:18):

Yeah, I thought it was interesting. One of the things that Hedgie said after the game was, it’s okay to be boring. It’s okay to just go out there and do your work and take your approach the way that you had been the whole time in terms of not trying to do too much, not trying to yank a ball over the wall or go crazy in changing your approach. He kept sort of hammering home the point boring is what got us here boring is just head down and lunch pail sort of mentality. And he said the younger players in the room have to learn how to adjust after taking the best shots from teams. The Tigers rearranged their pitching rotation in order to get Schobel pitching in this game Monday night to open the series. They wanted that matchup against Cleveland. So he says if teams are going to start game planning and arranging their pitching rotations to try and beat Cleveland, there’s going to have to be an adjustment made on the other side for the guardians.

Paul Hoynes (07:37):

Yeah, the Tigers have taken it to Cleveland. They’re five and three against them in the season series. They took three out of four recently at Comerica Park, and this is a team that’s 10 games out of first place. Joe is 10 games behind them in the Al Central. These guys and the guardians can’t lay a glove on them right now. They need some solid starting pitching and need. They just need some offense. They need to strike first. I think last night. Carrasco goes out there, gives up a two run Homer in the first inning. They score two more runs in the second. I’m talking about the Tigers on a misplay by Angel Martinez in center field. And then you’re sitting there, you’re already struggling if you’re the guardians, you’re sitting in the dugout and you’re going, here we go again. We’re down four, four, nothing, four to one. We haven’t scored anything. It’s almost do we mail this in and try again tomorrow?

Joe Noga (08:44):

And that’s when Hedges actually stepped up to the plate in a situation with the bases loaded and it was a spot that he was sort of familiar with back on May 22nd. He had an at bat in a game where the guardians were trailing. He stepped up and noticed the third baseman playing pretty deep and he dropped down a bunt and that sort of energized the dugout and got things going. Last night he did the same thing. He dropped down a perfect bunt down the third baseline, scored David Fry with a bunt single. And you thought, okay, maybe there’s some momentum here. Maybe there’s a little bit of a spark or something. But it just wasn’t the case. The guys that came up to the plate after Quan couldn’t break open a big inning and you thought, here we go again. It used to be you could just roll out any left-handed pitcher against the guardians and that was the formula to sort of keep them in line, keep their offense in check. Now they’ve got the best record in baseball against left-handed starters. But last night s Scbu was just too much.

Paul Hoynes (09:55):

Yeah, SCBU bobbed and weaved. He was good and he was fortunate as well. You, you give up 10 hits in seven innings, you’re living right. You got up on the right side of the bed.

Joe Noga (10:09):

As far as the play where you talked about Angel Martinez Misplay, a Ball by Jake Rogers into basically an inside the park home run. It was a triple and an error on Martinez. What’d you see on that play? And I’m still scratching my head as to why the replay didn’t overturn it. If Hedgie got the tag on him, it looked like he got him before his hand crossed the plate.

Paul Hoynes (10:37):

Yeah, just Joe, I don’t know. The guardians have taken the approach that they can bring up anybody and they can stick ‘em in center field and nothing bad is going to happen and the baseball gods have blessed these guys that there hasn’t been more plays like this. I don’t blame Angel Martinez for that. I think you’re just sticking a kid out there that started playing center field What? In spring training? Spring

Joe Noga (11:08):

Training,

Paul Hoynes (11:10):

And you’re telling him to go get it at the highest level of baseball. So he made a mistake and he made another mistake later in the game when he took a bad route on another double, and I think you are going to get burned by this if you keep doing this. Who is the Guardian Center fielder right now? Is it Martinez, is it Freeman? Whoever else thinks stuck out there, will Brennan. I don’t think you can have multiple center fielders sometimes times this has worked for Vote. He’s got him in first place playing musical chairs with everybody but three or four guys in the lineup, but it’s going to come back and bite you and it did last night and it gives you pause just for, I mean, when do you settle on one guy to play one position?

Joe Noga (12:06):

Yeah, it kind of looks like Martinez is going to get that opportunity here. Been opportunities to pull him out of that number two spot in the lineup and put Freeman back in center field and it hasn’t happened. I thought last night there might’ve been an opportunity for that, but Freeman was playing second base to give Andres Jimenez another guy that we should probably talk about slumping as well. It just seems to me that whoever seems to be the flavor of the moment hotter at the plate is going to get the opportunity to play. Last night, Tyler Freeman had three hits. I wouldn’t be surprised to see him out there in center tonight or the other possibility that we haven’t talked about yet. We could see him at shortstop at some point because as we were interviewing Carlos Carrasco last night, postgame in the Guardian’s Clubhouse not too far away, over a few lockers down, Brian Rocchio appeared to be clearing out his locker.

(13:15):

It looked like he was putting things in a box and he didn’t have a very positive look on his face at the time. All the signs indicate that a move is pending, an announcement of a move is pending in terms of Rocchio, it could be that he’s being optioned to aaa. We don’t know that for sure yet. The club hasn’t confirmed it, but we’ll find out here in the next few hours if that happens. It’s got to be a move to bring up a bat offense and inject some life into the lineup. But what does that mean if Rocchio is no longer there for the way that they handle the shortstop position, at least in the near future?

Paul Hoynes (14:00):

A great question, Joe. Great question. And Rocchi was not smiling ear to ear as he dumped the contents of his locker into a cardboard box and we didn’t see that a postage on it said that it was headed for a class, aaa, Columbus, but I think we might as well. There was a pretty good indication that he was moving somewhere.

Joe Noga (14:28):

Yeah, we’ve seen this happen enough. We sort of know how to read the signs and read the tea leaves here. Pretty good indication that something’s going to happen with.

Paul Hoynes (14:39):

Yeah, the only thing missing was the traveling secretary coming over and whispering in his ear and tell him when he’s expected to report. So you’ve got Schneeman. If Rocchio goes down, you’ve got Schneeman to play shortstop, but Joe, do you think he plays every day? I doubt that. I don’t think you’re going to play Schneeman every day at shortstop and you’ve got some options at Columbus. Tanya could come up and play a shortstop or do you go for a bat? Do you bring Jonathan Rodriguez back up or do you bring Mando back up and you play Freeman and Schneeman at short?

Joe Noga (15:22):

Yeah, obviously right now out of those candidates, I think Mando might be the one to give you the most in terms of offense. He’s sort of looked like he’s figured things out as of late in Columbus. Gabriel Arias another guy, he’s been down 10 days, so he’s probably able to come back up. But at what cost? He’s batting in three games. He’s had 13 at bats, he’s got four hits and four strikeouts in those three games for Columbus since being optioned down there. So it doesn’t look like he was really in the mix in the plans down there with the Clippers. Maybe an opportunity. Now you’ve got both Rocchio and Aria who you’re starting shortstops for the majority of the season now they’re both down in Columbus. Pretty much a disaster right there. The Guardians do have an open spot on their 40 man roster, so you never know if there’s somebody out there that they’re looking at as an option to bring in. But again, we’re getting closer to the trade deadline. So what does that mean for how they’re approaching things? Bobette is on the injured list in Toronto, so it’s not like he’s the solution to your problems there.

Paul Hoynes (16:52):

Yeah, and another interesting name kind of perked up the last few days, Joe James Paxton was DFA by the Dodgers. He’s eight and two with the Dodgers, the left-hander veteran. Do you think Cleveland might be interested in that and him?

Joe Noga (17:16):

I mean that could be, they can work out a trade with the Dodgers while Paxton has been designated for assignment. They’ve got what, 10 days or seven days to trade or seven days, seven days to trade ‘em or release them. That’s something that could be done. Maybe there’s a cash component to a deal as well. And weren’t the Dodgers back in the day hot on Rocchio as a prospect anyways when they talked about for Corey Kluber or Trevor Bauer or any of those guys, they were always talking about wanting Rocchio included in a deal and Cleveland was so reticent to do something like that. I guess there’s always an opportunity to explore a trade like that. Paxton would be a solid guy to stick in the rotation if they get an opportunity to. Who knows if that’s something that they’re looking for right now. I’m sure they’re making calls. As far as the division right now, we look up and we see Minnesota and Kansas City both playing pretty well. Both teams won last night as the guardians continue to struggle against teams in the American League. Central Ho, just what’s your take on Cleveland’s ability to hold off the twins and the Royals right now?

Paul Hoynes (18:47):

Yeah, Joe, I don’t think anything is under lock and key here. Kansas City’s eight and two in their last 10. The Royals are, I mean the twins are five and five. They’re both four games back. Cleveland’s smallest lead since mid June, early June. So we’re getting closer to the stretch run. And this could be a pennant race for a long time it didn’t look like that, but Cleveland’s coming back to the pack and if they want to put the brakes on, they’ve got to start hitting. They’ve got to start pitching better. They’ve got to try to, it just looks like they’re in a funk. Joe, and I don’t know if this, it is been 11 games, they haven’t played well. They face some good pitching. Is it just a slump where okay, you get out of it in two or three or four more games or is this a pattern’s been set? Is this the way they’re going to play for the last two and a half months of the season?

Joe Noga (19:57):

Yeah, I mean going into the final 67 games of the season at the All-Star Break, the guardians needed to play 500 baseball. They needed to play 500 the rest of the way out in order to win about 92 games. And you’d figure 92 games would get you a spot in the postseason. Whether that’s as a division champ or as one of the three wildcards right now, not playing at a 500 clip post all-star break. They need to get back to that and get back to what caused success offensively for them. Like Austin had just said the boring stuff was working just fine. So. Alright, Hoey, that’s going to wrap up today’s edition of the Cleveland Baseball Talk podcast. We will have coverage of tonight’s game and any moves prior to, and then we’ll check in with you again tomorrow. Alright, Joe.

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